Social Development

Black Panther · Senior Member

Social Development

abre les ojos · Guru

A bit of a rant there...

It is a little unwise to use Nigeria as an example considering that fact that it has the oldest universities in Africa, a long history of educational development, oil wealth, and a totally different culture to that of Malawi and southern Africa in general.

Every society does need to prioritise. The fields needed the most are the doctors, agriculturalists, teachers etc. Encouraging philosophy, sociology and the like can be taught at a secondary school level. The syllabus in secondary school in dire in Malawi. This forum is a testament to that.

Black Panther · Senior Member

abre les ojos wrote:

A bit of a rant there... It is a little unwise to use Nigeria as an example considering that fact that it has the oldest universities in Africa, a long history of educational development, oil wealth, and a totally different culture to that of Malawi and southern Africa in general. Every society does need to prioritise. The fields needed the most are the doctors, agriculturalists, teachers etc. Encouraging philosophy, sociology and the like can be taught at a secondary school level. The syllabus in secondary school in dire in Malawi. This forum is a testament to that.

I can use Naigeria and any country in African b/c they all have commodities. How we manage them and the people behind theri sucess is what differs. I have no doubt that had Malawi had a more substatial intellectual class , we would be able to manage our reources. Including tap oil in our lake and not let it go to the dogs. Malawi has been training drs, agric, and teachers ...etc.. but we need thos professional that have the backing of social development. socio-economic development , rather then just economic development. At secondary level, people are not mature enought to grasp philosphical concepts. Philosophy is not for the masses....niether is sociology. People in college that do math for example usually dont fair well in subjects lik Sociology or Philosphy...and Im not talking abuot sociology 101 ..which is basic and only scratches the surface..... What I mean is that there are different types of intelligence,..the math type - ie..smart-genius type, and the overall concept/philosophy - wise type... We need to foster both...

We need to have these emphasied more at teritary levels so that concepts like Marxism that are tailored for Malawians have space to thrive. What good is a dr when the society around him is crumbling. thisng like agruclutre, yes, teach those in high schools , particulary in the agrigarian setting. My point is that they should be e better balance, at all levels.

abre les ojos · Guru

... But what good is a philosopher without a doctor. If we look to the East for example, the investments have been made in technical knowledge and less on sociology etc. See where that knowledge is taking them...

Technical knowledge is a lot more beneficial. So is scientific knowledge. We have to accept we live in a post-ideoligical world and either we spend our days navel-gazing and moaning about our lost "history" or take it in our hands and get on with business.

I am sick and tired of that victim culture that pervades black folks..

awmygawd · Guru

abre les ojos wrote:

The syllabus in secondary school in dire in Malawi. This forum is a testament to that.

The unpleasant has an annoying predilection for being the truth as well... How unfortunate.

Black Panther · Senior Member

abre les ojos wrote:

... But what good is a philosopher without a doctor. If we look to the East for example, the investments have been made in technical knowledge and less on sociology etc. See where that knowledge is taking them... Technical knowledge is a lot more beneficial. So is scientific knowledge. We have to accept we live in a post-ideoligical world and either we spend our days navel-gazing and moaning about our lost "history" or take it in our hands and get on with business. I am sick and tired of that victim culture that pervades black folks..

Let me put it this way.... we shouldnt put all our eggs in one basket. We need a good balance. The past couple of years , whats been happening is that pple have come up with ideas to improve this sector and that but its not been working. there is no glues to bind this. Let me use an example for those that arent sure what philosophers and theri sister, sociologists bring for a society.

..the early sociologists are the people that come up with concepts like marxism & democracy...they help make public policies about what over-all concepts will work in a society - they make models of society. There is no point in training a 100 drs if there is no overall plan to shape the society...different bodies in society from the judicial to the medical, to the agricultural , to economic are all interdependant, doing one thing in one sector sills over to the next. The role of a sociologist in this case would be to bridge these factors so that the society as a whole is functioning and productive. Philosphers are more about thinking up theories, true, but these ealry philosophers thought up the models of the structutres we use in society today... this is how polititcal concepts first came about from ..Montesque, to Marx to Durkheim...these thinkers came up with solutions...

If you emphasize just one, u can event something an it will be cool but irrelevant to ur society.... The major thing is that innovation is not done by trial and error. Someone has to think about it first, before putting in to practice. We need to teach people that its ok to think outside the box..ideas come with encouraging lateral thinking. America has been able to progress b/c it encourages lateral thinking...it encourages people that think.

awmygawd · Guru

Black Panther wrote:

My point is that they should be e better balance, at all levels.

You're right about balance although I'm inclined to agree with Abre on placing more emphasis on science and technology. I don't know much about sociology, etc (the closest I've ever come to studying those is via corporate ethics) so there isn't much I can say about that, what I will comment on is the balance between techinical and business knowledge. In Malawi there isn't much of a tradition of engineering & science graduates pursuing further business related studies and that's a major problem. The other problem is with the excessive specialism of Malawian business graduates - in business! (or their fields within business e.g accountancy, etc). This could be fixed by:

-restricting (or controlling) undergraduate study in business related fields.

-beefing up secondary maths & science or introducing a new level of secondary school study altogether simillar to the A-levels (to free UNIMA course delivery time).

- introducing joint undergraduate degrees in the universities (making it possible to study for a degree in e.g. Computer Science and marketing

- Introducing extended combined courses (e.g. five years to get a BEng and Bba)

so on and so forth. That way:

-science and engineering graduates wouldn't be as helpless when they graduate. Self employment within their field would be a viable option.

-technology dependent companies like Escom would be better run (following the path of the Malawian financial services sector)

-there would be better interaction (and synergy) between engineers and other professionals e.g lawyers and accountants who would now have the opportunity to use their knowlegde to its fullest effect

-the revenue and employment generated by the engineering sector would multiply through support industries.

-the economy as a whole would better off.

-- Edited by awmygawd at 23:24, 2006-05-24

abre les ojos · Guru

I agree.

But BlackPanther, I sincerely believe that American development was as a result of a historical advantage as opposed to its nurturing of lateral thought. If anything America has been able to develop in spite of the lack of it. Slavery, WWII etc have been better factors in it. most of the greatest minds on the last century came from Europe and migrated to America because of the instability of Europe in that period.

But leave out that for a moment. Asia - the new power block- is placing emphasis on technology and that is why there has been a huge surge in their respective economies. The main reason outsourcing is possible is because of the fact that they have the skills in the first place. Africa needs to nurture those skills if it wants to break out of the poverty cycle.

Africa is not short of thinkers and ideologues. In fact it has too many of them. What it lacks however is the tradition of technological knowhow, that ought to change. Most of the knowledge that Africa relies on the west for can easily be nurtured from tertiary education. The only way out is to compete with Asia in that respect.

Dzimveremuntolo · Newbie

This is an interesting topic and couldn't resist to comment. Our system of education lacks the ability to turn our brilliant scientists into innovators because partly due to non-existent research partnerships with industry and also due to a fundamentally flawed attitude towards education.

The schoolboy/girl dream after finishing school is to occuoy one of those white elephants be it at capital hill or gemini house. We should start right in our homes educating our kids that education is not only a means to getting jobs but also a means to create jobs!! In the end we can turn this culture of dependence around because our engineers will think of making ox-carts (ngolo) better tools for our farmers. I haven't seen a change in the design of this important farm tool since I was born!! Again it comes to lack of a connection between the way we view science and how it can be commercialised to benefit the general populace.

Although heavily underfunded, the university can turn this around by carrying out research whose results should not only foster a culture of innovation but also have a slant of enterpreneurship to it. ie researching into areas which can not only be turned into business ideas within the context of malawi's socio-economic development but also be able to improve lives of the general populace. A simple example would be researching into cost-effective methods of irrigation to remove reliance on erratic rains. I am sure this kind of research will not require large amounts of funding and can later be turned into a commercially viable venture.

We can develop our own industry to solve our problems!!

awmygawd · Guru

Dzimveremuntolo wrote:

Our system of education lacks the ability to turn our brilliant scientists into innovators because partly due to non-existent research partnerships with industry and also due to a fundamentally flawed attitude towards education. The schoolboy/girl dream after finishing school is to occuoy one of those white elephants be it at capital hill or gemini house. We should start right in our homes educating our kids that education is not only a means to getting jobs but also a means to create jobs!! In the end we can turn this culture of dependence around because our engineers will think of making ox-carts (ngolo) better tools for our farmers. I haven't seen a change in the design of this important farm tool since I was born!! Again it comes to lack of a connection between the way we view science and how it can be commercialised to benefit the general populace.

Good point.

Black Panther · Senior Member

awmygawd wrote:

Dzimveremuntolo wrote: Our system of education lacks the ability to turn our brilliant scientists into innovators because partly due to non-existent research partnerships with industry and also due to a fundamentally flawed attitude towards education. The schoolboy/girl dream after finishing school is to occuoy one of those white elephants be it at capital hill or gemini house. We should start right in our homes educating our kids that education is not only a means to getting jobs but also a means to create jobs!! In the end we can turn this culture of dependence around because our engineers will think of making ox-carts (ngolo) better tools for our farmers. I haven't seen a change in the design of this important farm tool since I was born!! Again it comes to lack of a connection between the way we view science and how it can be commercialised to benefit the general populace. Good point.

I second that. good point.

innovation isnt taught in college though. we are being taught to get the degree. then what.

Awmygad, mentioned simple thing the university could do.. Iwoudl like to add to that and say that, the University should also , perhaps make a business minor requirment for graduation. No matter what feild people should be taught how to be innovative. This though ultimatlety should start in elementary school.

There is no way beefing up the computer science curriculum will dramatically help development. Development is not just about getting IT industry up to par. Development mean increasing the quality of life, runing water , access to health care...those kind of things will spur an economy becasue it will give people free time to think about economic factors,opening businesses etc...computer science is fine, but how many computer scienctists do we need in Malawi ? who will hire there services , thats just concentraiting on training people that will leave the country.. and not eveutually really support the economy..There are other countires like India that are taking this niche right now , and I dont think we need to compete.

Abre, in Malawis case ..necessity is not the mother of all invention b/c we appear to be satisfied with what we have.. so there are several reasons why America developed ...for America I would recomend you read "Guns Germs and steel" - it talks about why someplaces developed and not others... but innovation is key.. when someone opens up a business in Malawi 20 people do the exact same thing... In most cases they dont event improve on the original idea. its just the same. We should encourage ourselves to develop as a society ..get rid of haterd , jeaoulsy , stuff like that b/c people undermine eachother... I remember in the 1970s American TV veiwers were bombarded with commercials showing people how to act 'it addressed those type of things ..jealousy... inertia etc..this may seem insignificant but these types of things hold us back....they can hold a scientist back ..- ie he may not want to share his ideas..he may have an idea but not know how to market himself...although processes as individuals,social develpment, get social scientist to come up with a concept like african democracy .... and this will lead to socio-economic development...this is why this term came about socio-economic..they are inter-dependent.

damn. I promised myself I wouldnt rant..

abre les ojos · Guru

Let's not blame jealousy and hatred on Malawi's lack of development. In fact I'm sure if you look at it, there is less of it in Malawi than there is in say India or anywhere else. You might as well blame laziness or stupidity.

You see, history is hardly on our side in Africa and leadership has hardly been forthcoming in changing the negative effects of colonialism.

You are making too broad statements without looking at the cultural and historical aspects of why Africa is the way it is and how it can change for the better. Black Africans don't have less love for each other than Americans or Europeans, so lets not even go there.

Look at Nigeria for instance. A country with over 200 tribes and languages with Oil concentrated in the south east only. Imagine if that was Europe - made into one big country (Europe has just over 20 Languages) and oil in Germany only. Knowing European history I'm sure it would be chaos.

For Africa to compete with the west a great big rethink is necessary. Forging new alliances with Asia (which is happening) which is the new technological base. Innovation might be happening in the west, but the east makes it possible for the west to have the standards of living it has.

How can Africa take advantage of that? By focusing on providing the raw materials for it in exchange for knowledge and innovation as opposed to short term gain. Opening up for these countries for their knowledge. Knowledge is the only way out. The right kind of knowledge.

Africa would probably at some point have to come up with a union similar to the EU. Sooner or later. A collective body to deal with its debt, trade and alliances. The old theory of divide and conquer still work on Africa. Mbeki impressed me last night in a BBC interview when he said (among a lot of other things) that it wasn't in his power, or business to "deal" with Mugabe. Zimbabwe's issues were best internally left to Zimbabweans. That's the spirit to adopt.

We ought to look to South America for ideas of how to break the colonialist cycle, and Asia of how to trade on it. Africa needs to slowly cut ties with the west. Or change its dealings. Sooner, not later actually.