GOD BELIEF & ATHEIST

abre les ojos · Guru

GOD BELIEF & ATHEIST

Lady B · Senior Member

RE: GOD BELIEF & ATHEIST

abre les ojos · Guru

Religion IS a form of social control and even atheist agree that the illusional or delusional aspects of it can keep people in check. As a whole I can't argue with its benefits.

But and I use "but" sparingly. The evil that religion has done outweighs the good. Look through history. It is a testament to human nature not religion per se, but religion is man made hence it can be used to justify all evil.

Slavery, war rape, paedophilia, child killing, it's all there in the Bible justified apparently by God.

Let's not forget everything else even today....

Lady B · Senior Member

I would say society is already moving in that direction, and it’s only a matter of time before religion runs its course. There will always be religions and spirituality; humanity has a need to feel as if there is something greater. Whether there is something greater or not is another question. Because as long as there are questions like: Where do we come from? Is the mind a form of spirit or just a chemical reaction? Do we live after death? Is there more to the world than what we can see with our five senses?

Until people stop asking these questions or they become answered, religion will always have a foothold on peoples mind
*Kiss*

game · Guru

man

stop reading the DA VINCI CODE Dan brown goes to church and he believes in God thats why he corrected the myth revolving round MARY MAGDALENE,i do understand your points but why cant you just give to ceasar whats his and to God whats his noone will be on your case.

abre les ojos · Guru

Sorry but I found the Da Vinci Code quite badly written fiction.

malawian · Veteran Member

Religion has indeed played a negative role in many historical events in modern times. That doesnt mean that all religions are bad. The religions that do not practice what they teach are not religions. By fruits you'll know if a tree is good or bad; Jesus said. This means that all those religions that encouraged the killings are not accurate and true. As a matter of fact, such religions have alienated people from the bible and even from God.

For example in Rwanda in 1994, Catholic and Protestant Hutus tribesmen killed Tutsis belonging to the same religions. In their churches, love was taught but during the genocide, they practiced the opposite of what they were taught.

As long as you practice a religion that follows the bible and God without hypocrisy you will have real hope.

abre les ojos · Guru

No religion can really practice what they preach since their texts are vague and open to personal interpretation. That's why they are different within every religion some of which don't even agree on anything at all.

Anyone who's read the old testament (if you look at it as a historically accurate account) will see it is full of wars, genocides and all that stuff by people who claimed they were doing it through divine intervention. The first half of the bible is by far the most violent ancient book in history.

It is the very reason why pro-christian states i.e. the US believe they have the right to support Israel over Palestine for instance.

Unfortunately religious people always look the other way to the obscene and brutality that their beliefs inspire.

I hate to shatter your illusion but religion IS the problem and not the solution to world peace....

malawian · Veteran Member

Do not blame the Bible because it's not vague. If you deeply study the Bible, you will understand that it complement itself and it's not vague.

Here the blame should be on the head of those pretending to be religious while not practising what they teach. Not on the Bible.

abre les ojos · Guru

Enlighten me. From what I've read there's some serious violence and stuff in it. If that isn't hypecritical then I don't know what is...

malawian · Veteran Member

I agree that they is violence happening in some Bible books. There's justification behind those actions. Take the examplle of Israelites taking possession of the promised land. The people living there like the sons of Canaan,Jericho were not cooperative.

Well it's not hypocritical because these people had to do this in fear of their own death. The other nations also had armies, they could attack at any time.

abre les ojos · Guru

YOU SEE USING GOD AS A JUSTIFICATION FOR VIOLENCE HAS TO BE THE WORST FORM OF VIOLENCE ONE CAN DO. THE ISREALITES BELIEVING THAT THEY ARE "CHILDREN OF GOD" HAD THE RIGHT TO KILL EVERYONE ELSE TO GET THEIR LANDS? HOW ABSURD!

THAT IS THE LEGACY OF WHAT WE HAVE IN PALESTINE TODAY. JEWS CLAIMING LAND BECAUSE THE SAY THAT GOD GAVE IT TO THEM IN THE BIBLE. IF THAT ISN'T THE WORST FORM OF DELUSION I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS.

SO, ANYONE CAN CLAIM GOD AND KILL INNOCENT PEOPLE. LOOK AT AMERICA TODAY. THEY BELEIVE THAT GOD IS ALWAYS ON THEIR SIDE WHEN THEY GO OUT AND KILL CHILDREN AND WOMEN.

game · Guru

abre

let me ask you a question,if you know that something has been taken from you which you feel is yours or your birth right,wouldnt you feel the need to claim it back even if it means blood and death?

and why do people start revolutions?che guevara for example,wait a minute,mandela could be a good example for you.

malawian · Veteran Member

Again, do not blame the Bible. The americans are not following a religion without Hypocrisy. They are hypocrites. Well it's very hard to explain because at first if you do not believe in God, then there's no common ground. We'll be all talking and talking endlessly.

abre les ojos · Guru

YOU SEE THE JEWS LEFT ISREAL OVER SEVERAL GENERATIONS TILL THEY HAD SETTLED AROUND EUROPE AND YES, LIKE INDIANS WERE VERY GOOD AT TRADE AND BUSINESS - THEY PROSPERED.

UNFORTUNATELY, POST WWII AND THE HOLOCAUST THE WESTERN GOVERNMENTS PROPOSED THAT THE DISPOSED JEWS START SETTLEMENTS IN THEIR "BIBLICAL" HOMELAND. PALESTINE BEING PART OF THE BRITISH COLONY TAKEN FROM THE OTTOMAN EMPIRE AFTER WWI.

TOO BAD THE LAND HAD BEEN TAKEN OVER BY GENERATIONS OF PALESTINIANS. WHERE DO THEY GO? THANKS TO AMERICAN SUPPORT AND THE POWERFUL JEWISH LOBBIES IN WASHINGTON - THE REST IS HISTORY.

SO, PALESTINIANS THAT DON'T BELIEVE THE BIBLE GAVE JEWS THE RIGHT TO THEIR HOMELAND VERSUS WESTERN JUDEO-CHRISTIAN BACKED JEWS THAT BELIEVE THEY ARE.

OF COURSE THERE IS MORE TO THE CONFLICT BUT YOU SEE HOW FAR IT CAN GO...

malawian · Veteran Member

I get your point. But again, we come back to the same concept; blaming those who do things in the name of religion. Evryone who does not practice what they teach are condemning themselves.

Ancient Jews and present Jews are very different. The ancient ones were God's chosen ones but after their refusal of Jesus, God opened the way for any honesthearted. (Cornelius being the first gentile).

If they are fighting now about the land, it's not really under God's blessing.

Any human (regarless of their nationality) who serves God without hypocrisy can be approved and blessed by the Almighty.

abre les ojos · Guru

Don't give me that rubbish about God's chosen people. Jews made up about .005% of the world polpulation. God must really be prejudiced or just plain short-sighted to single out a group of people.

Either you believe all that Jewish nonesense or you open your mind to the fact that everyone, all the time were God's children. It also boils down to a racial issue. YOU a black man believing that YOUR God has preferences in other white people. Boy you must either be brainwashed or just a moron.

malawian · Veteran Member

Neither brainwashed or a moron I am. Well as I said, it's just gonna be very very complicating to explain my point when at first someone does not believe in a God.

abre les ojos · Guru

Sorry I meant mormon. My apologies.

Well, precisely my point. It takes a certain mind to challenge the existence of Go. To see beyond convention, beyond dogma, beyond accepted norms. To see between the lies of the past and ask profound questions of why do I go to church and stuff. I can go on forever about why atheists are right and religious people are close to dementia, but I'll save it for later.

malawian · Veteran Member

Atheists reject the existence of God. But isn't it worth finding out what are the reasons behind their stand? I talked to one and he simply told me that the belief in God brings a sense of guilt, a sense of answering charges etc. Some say it's the lack of evidence of God in what is happening in today's world's scene. But there are tons of evidence supporting God's existence.

Religious people do not meditate and think think think about spiritual stuff. It's part of their lives. They believe in something greater than themselves.

abre les ojos · Guru

Well I KNOW we are just as we are. Nothing bigger than us except everything. We are just nothing! We die and are recycled. No mystery about that..

malawian · Veteran Member

There's no mystery. Then why are we here? To die to recycle? Not all, there's a purpose. There are reasons why we are here. There are reasons why only planet earth contains gasses helping to sustain life. There are reasons why we can never grow plants on Mars, Jupiter but only on earth. Life has a purpose.

abre les ojos · Guru

You gotta accept the fact that things don't have a purpose. You are not a unique specimen, you are just a mixture of molecules and atoms. The world the universe in its mass and size doesn't mean a thing. It's just there. We believe all this crap about spirits and life and death because we are afraid to accept that we are nothing in the world, nothing to the universe than a batch of molecules that will fall away and become part of something else. WE ARE NOTHING SPECIAL - THERE IS NO GOD - THE ONLY PURPOSE OF LIFE IS TO LIVE IT AND DIE IT - OH YES AND REPRODUCE TO KEEP IT FLOWING...

malawian · Veteran Member

The evidence of the existence of a creator can be seen in the design, order, and complexity of living things on earth.Look at the design, order, and complexity of the universe with its billions of galaxies, each containing billions of stars. And all the heavenly bodies are controlled by precise laws, such as those for motion, heat, light, sound, electromagnetism, and gravity.

If the other planets lack some of the component beneficial for existence, and only earth contains them. Then we were meant to be here. Meant to exist, meant to live on earth.

Think about this; can there be laws without a lawmaker? I really like the following quote by Rocket scientist Dr. Wernher von Braun : "The natural laws of the universe are so precise that we have no difficulty building a spaceship to fly to the moon and can time the flight with the precision of a fraction of a second. These laws must have been set by somebody." Who is that "somebody"?? God the creator, of course.

abre les ojos · Guru

That doesn't mean a thing. Been here before and I'm pretty tired of these old cliches.

When God appears to you and tells you this, call me...

malawian · Veteran Member

Well, if you have spiritual proofs against the existence of God, tell me.

abre les ojos · Guru

It ticks me off when intelligent people use that word "spiritual". Which really mean emotion. What spirit? I asked this question and no one seems to answer me yet. WHY IS IT NEVER ADMISSABLE IN COURT - I mean the spiritual rubbish...

malawian · Veteran Member

RE: GOD BELIEF & ATHEIST

abre les ojos · Guru

You didn't answer my question.

Say for instance someone claimed to be influenced by the spirit and went on to do something right or wrong, any court will throw out the evidence. Unfortunately we still entertain "spiritual" matters, why? Don't ask me but it is shrinking fast and secularism is where its at this century. Away from the witch-burning and stuff and all those religious rubbish (unless you are in America where they sometimes still seem to be in the middle ages)

You spiritual types want to enjoy the benefits of science but hypocritically ignore it when we say "hey evolution is real". Makes me wonder.

Why don't you all pray to whatever when you get sick like they used to (did they ever).

-- Edited by abre les ojos at 00:33, 2005-08-18